Hi Guys

Can anyone who has an interest in downhill mountainbiking to please help me out by filling in the questionaire at the following link.
http://www.eSurveysPro.com/Survey.aspx? ... 1e86d2836b

Please be as honest as you can be when answering the questions.

Thanks

John

"This survey is currently closed. "

Hi

It's open now.

John

Hey John, if you don't mind me asking what is the purpose of the survey? Is it for an editorial piece? Just curious. I always think there are a few points in the debate that people frequently miss.

See ya about.
Chris

Hi Chris

The questionnaire is for a research paper I am doing for college. None of the results will be published anywhere. I just want to find out what peoples views are on the issue talked about in the questionnaire.

Do you think there is anything I left out that should be in there?

thanks to everybody so far who posted replies.

John

Em, I'm not sure wheter you left anything out, you covered all the major points I think, I suppose I'd need to know the type of paper your writing for college, I thought you where doing some media focused course, maybe that's the angle your after.

I think what I'm trying to say really is that people seem to always polarise this debate and have it as a black and white discussion of form versus function and I honestly think it's way more varied then that.

We all know that skinsuits are faster, above a certain speed at least, but why should anyone wear one when none of the other equipment we use is aerodynamically designed. As an example in Alpine Ski racing, the boots, bindings, helmet, skinsuit, ski poles are all designed for maximum efficiency and aerodynamics, even the exact "tuck" position, ski pole angle are tested in wind tunnels to maximise airflow and rightly so when gliding and max speed (120km/h +) are key for victory. But when you see the "technical" events in alpine ski racing, Giant Slalom and Slalom, then the requirements for protection and quick turning outweigh the absolute need for aerodynamics and thus the clothing/equipment of the athletes changes.

So in our sport if people really think that we should be wearing skinsuits for maximum speed and performance, why hasn't the industry taken the sport a step further and designed everything around maximum speed? (Trek at Canberra worlds last year being a tiny/slight exception) The bicycles, helmets, shoes and pedals are designed for maximum technically function and not speed and I think the clothes we wear should be seen in the same light. DH is a technical sport not a speed one and as such "Speedsuits" should play no part in our sport.

We just happen to be lucky that a sport like Motocross has very similar movement patterns and planes of anatomical motion as our own sport which means we can wear their "kit" and possible recieve the benefits of real research into proper ergonomic/anatomical design.

Cheers John, hope the paper goes well!

When I first became interested in road racing, back in the early 80s, a cyclist had to wear plain black shorts.
Over the years, because of sponsors' pressure, this rule was changed, so now we have riders wearing coloured shorts, showing sponsors' logos, advertising and colours. this became the norm, except in World Championships, where cyclists still had to wear national colours. This changed, now cyclists are allowed to wear their trade shorts in Continental and World Champs.
In the major tours, where cyclists were in yellow or green(points) or polka dot(mountain), riders continued to wear plain shorts.
This too changed, now you see riders wearing shorts and indeed bikes to match their winning jersey. These changes came about, for the most part because of pressure from sponsors. That's fair enough, after all they pay the wages, none of these changes slowed the riders down.
Now we have the situation in DH, where again the pressure is coming from sponsors, who want to portray a certain image for the sport. In their eyes skin suits and tight clothes are "nerdy"and MX gear is cool.
In DH, the Showcase event is the World Championships. Here, the trade teams, officially, have no function. Managers, with no sponsors to cater too, chose the clothing, most suited, to get fast times, that is skin suits. Every country did it. I remember Peaty, Hill and all the best riders wearing tight clothing at Worlds. Again the sponsors forced the UCI to change the rules. After all the sponsors pay the UCI substantial amounts for every inch of advertising, displayed on riders' clothing. Money talks.

Chris says "DH is a technical sport not a speed one and as such "Speedsuits" should play no part in our sport"
Surely DH is just that: "A SpeedSport". You don't get points for style or big air or technical prowess. You get points for SPEED.

Why do the UCI have to be so dictatorial in this regard??? Why can they not allow each team and rider make up their own mind??
On a course, where speedsuits make a difference let the riders wear them. If sponsors insist on riders wearing MX gear, in order to look "Cool", let them suffer the consequences. The answer "Money talks".
I think, that the MX comparison is a red herring. Why should DH slavishly follow other sports??. Why not develop clothing, that best suits our sport, instead of copying other sports where they use engines ??. To me it's like the young lad, who put cardboard in the spokes of his bike, to make it sound like a motorbike!!
In Slalom Skiing, is loose clothing COMPULSORY ???
Sorry J. for hijacking your thread.


Eamonn.

Some good points Eammonn, you'll have to give John a hand with the paper!

You've hit on a point that I always wonder about. Is it an unwillingness or a fear that stops the bike companies/teams/riders or team managers from braking completely away from road cycling or moto and designing some kit that looks better then a skinsuit, offers more protection then a skinsuit, but has some of the aerodynamic advantage of a skinsuit with maybe some less "roadie" looks. Maybe for a sport thats only 30 years that is too much to ask?

There is also still the question of why one should strap on a skinsuit when none of the other kit we wear has any major aerodynamic consideration put into it.

Also a skinsuit is all good for one race run as an all or nothing kind of approach, just like in Alpine skiing where in some events you don't even get a practice run only inspection runs, but as a garment to wear for 3 days of practice before racing, well it just doesn't provide enough protection from either the terrain in the event of a crash or the elements if the weather is c**p to wear all weekend long, for every run you do.

To say that the ONLY reason teams and riders or sponsors like to choose moto looking kit is fashion is completly wrong in my opinion, like it or not there are some similarities in terrain, crashes and the functional anatomy of both DH and Moto that mean we can wear the kit designed for moto and benfit from the tough materials and shaoe of the kit.

My point about slalom skiing was that while they still wear a skinsuit in race runs the skiers also wear knees guards, face protectors and pole guards which are necessary for protection from the poles, all of these added pieces of equipment might not be as aerodynamic, they are necessary and as the speeds are slower then say in Super G the effect of wearing them is less noticeable. Just like in DH mtb, where the rest of the equipment is designed for functionality not outright aerodynamics.

I also really think that DH is a technical event not a speed one, out right technical ability is one of the biggest deciding factors in the outcome of downhill races, not the top speed you have on the one or maybe two "open" or "fast" sections. My definition of a "speed" event would be ones which have consistent speeds over 85-120km/h like say Luge or Bobsleigh afterall to use the Alpine skiing comparison again, the "Speed" events there are Downhill and Super G while Giant Slalom and Slalom are referred to as the "technical" events.

I think the bottom line here is instead of saying it either has to be skinsuits or moto, the teams and manufactuars need to figure out the kit that works best for our unique sport in terms of the best balance of looks, aerodymanics, protection and sponsor exposure!

Yes guys its all about money. The sponsers say jump and the rule makers say how high? Let people ware what they want. Its only a matter of time before some company comes up with a clever idea for going faster with a new bike or equipment design. Then all will change or be banned again.
Its an individual sport so one should be allowed to think for themselves.

The skinsuit ban is the most ridiculous and stupid thing i have ever heard of in my life.

It is most definetly fashion over function. Rob Warner asked several riders in Fort Bill a few years ago when Mojo showed up in them. Everyone said they wouldn't wear because of the look.

Now, honestly. We are a CYCLING sport, not MX. We are going around like eejits pretending to be something we are not. We have taken enough from the MX world so shouldn't we be trying to keep a distance?

As for skinsuits not making a difference. I refer you to Fort Bill, again, with the Mojo Boys. The cut 6 seconds of their time. I'd rather look like a condom full of porridge and win, rather than a wannabe MX rider and lose.

The skinsuit ban is holding the sport back. Sponsors want their logo clearly shown. if your gear is flapping around, it won't be seen. MTB was at its height in terms of tv time and non-bike related sponsors when everyone was in lycra. The minute the sport took up this rebelious, cool look, they fecked off.

As for protection, armour can easily be worn under it and the material could be made thicker for DH use.

The rule as well is "tight-fitting clothing" what exactly is tight fitting?

In his original reply, Kilmurray says, that speedsuits should play no part in DH. This is the thing, that I disagree with
most. There are courses, where skinsuits are patently quicker than MX gear. In these cases, I see no reason, why riders should not be allowed wear the clothing, that best suits the course. The UCI have taken the choice away, and thereby are damaging the sport.
Give the riders the choice.
Down with fascism

Eamonn